Do you think He Zhiwen could have been the GOAT and not Joo Sae-hyuk

[Maria%]

Most rational minded players understand why Joo Sae-hyuk is the real GOAT of all of table tennis
But I always wondered about this.
He Zhiwen is a Chinese born TPG (Traditional Penhold Grip) wide pips with sponge player who played for Spain
He Zhiwen is an incredible natural athlete and all wide pips players have to be , to play at such high level
Even well past his prime he had beaten players like Ryu Seung-min , the 2004 Olympic gold medalist
Even more amazing that he was one of best serves in the sport even using wide pips.
For those who are not aware wide pips sit right in the middle of the spin continuum and have the least spin production capability since by design wide pips are mostly flat hitting rubbers.
One can generate some spin but not top spins anywhere close to common law illegally boosted spinny inverted rubbers or produce back actual non ITTF real long pips.
Also he has to have the most incredible reflexes of any player I have seen even at the highest level because I have never ever seen him leave the table for lobing etc.
All that I am not sure if he had lived up to his potential.
His not playing RPG (Reverse Penhold Grip)or HPG (Hybrid Penhold Grip) was not an issue.
But I had to wonder if he would have been the GOAT if had some sort of spinny inverted rubber on the off side .
All he had to do was twiddle just to serve and twiddle back to his normal wide pips.
His serves would have been even more devastatingly effective using spinny inverted.
This is exactly what the many time USA champion David Zhuang did
David Zhuang is Chinese born & I heard was a school mate of 2 times wide pips world champion TPG penholder Jiang JiaLiang)
I think he probably can still do some damage even at his age (64) now especially if he also played some HPG like Liu GuoLiang
This could be a lesson for all future aspiring TPG players

[Roberto^]

There is another option for him
Since he is a close to the table block & smash player , he can do the following

1. Go to a smart blade. His forehand layer composition would remain the same but his other side would be a soft layer composition
2. His forehand rubber would be the same frictioned wide pips with sponge
3. But the change is the rubber on other side . It would be an OX frictionless type actual long pips (Does he even play in ITTF tournaments anymore ? If not he can use actual long pips or even pre 2008 slim pips)

He can occasionally twiddle mostly to return serve to use the OX pips or during a rally to block strategically like Liu Guoliang
( He can take paid lessons from the absolute masters like Ni Xialian or Zhou Xintong )

Age is not a factor for him. Based on his past he is effectively 35 to 40 years old
Also I do not think he is in the primary WTT circuit anyway , so how does it even matter ? He can experiment

But I think he can still cause major upsets if he does this

[Fredro]

Or he can use both setups below (as detailed in posts above depending on opponents or other factors etc
An amateur like me would have serious prole adjusting to switching between two setups match by match
But his high skill level & feel for the ball he should have no problem switching back and forth at will between matches

One setup :- Same wide pis he is using now on one side & spinny inverted on other side (for serve variations or even play occasional RP loops from backhand side

Second setup :- Same wide pis he is using now on one side & frictionless actual long pips or pre 2008 slim pips for blocking after twiddling

This setup can be emulated by many other TPG players as well at all levels
These are players who are stuck to limited options now using TPG (but nowhere as skilled as He Zhiwen to get away with that limitation)

[James Z]

8 years ago I played at the New York International TT Club in Flushing a couple of times
Item 4 at link below. Not sure if that place is still there
https://pongplace.com/guides/table-tenn ... nis-center
One day I say a player walk by & looked quite familiar . he proceeded to upstairs and started coaching some kids
All of the were loopers using spinny inverted rubbers.
Still it puzzled me as to who it was.
Later I found out that he was indeed He Zhiwen just visiting USA for a month or two.
I was confused because he was coaching inverted loopers.
Goes to show that it would not be hard at all for him to use spinny inverted to just serve (and he may be able to coach inverted loopers but I doubt he can play at the highest level using spiny inverted since it seems he had always only used wide pips all his life)
But his serves using spinny inverted rubber could be even more lethal for sure using inverted even at the highest levels

You can see a list of all clubs to play in USA ( or Texas , with detailed analysis) at webpages below
https://ttclubs.blogspot.com/p/usa-clubs.html

[James Z]

Lot of players told me that that a smart blade with wide pips with thick spong on primary side in TPG mode with spinny inverted on other side was way too heavy. especially for a penholder.
So it prefers on your weight preference. Some prefer heavier blade and others prefer lighter blades.

If you prefer a heavier blade you can go with thich (soft) spong inverted for heavier spins
If you prefer lighter bblades , you are sort of stuck with a thin sponge and you may may not get max spin but it is till far better than leaving your back side with no sponge , the huge mistake that many TPG players make.

Of course if you are using non-ITTF long pips or ITTF slim pips on back side, this is a mute point because you should only be using OX and not even thin spong.